Author Topic: Candyz Pop  (Read 16584 times)

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Cassiopeia

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« on: June 11, 2006, 07:31:42 am »
Username: The username I would really like to get is Candyz Pop, which is the current name of the website I have.

E-mail: The e-mail I use for public use is candyzpop@yahoo.com. But if you need my personal e-mail, I'd appreciate if you would e-mail my public one first to ask for my private one. ^_^...

Site description: Candyz Pop is my site where I post both my original/fan artwork, as well as my comic Project K.R.O.W.. I have only gotten a couple pages of the manga up so far, but will post much more! ^_^. The story of my manga is about a girl named Casselia who is a leader of a gang and has lost both parents. But just when she thinks life is as good as it can get for someone like her, a new student arrives and changes the course of her life. This manga is rated OT, for Older Teens meaning 16+, which I have already stated in the about section. I'll also try to make that more clear by putting it on the notes on the cover page, considering not everyone reads the about sections. I may also have some pictures of the cast that are not suited for 13 or under, but I will state that as well before I post them up. Beleive me, I don't want to tramatize kids @_@... Also, all my links to other sites should be safe.

Convincing time!: XD! Alright! I belive you should host my manga/art site because I'm really trying to go for an orginal new manga. I've tryed to design charachters with new looks, such as tigered stripe hair color! XD! I also thought that their are basically no manga's that sees life through a girl that has joined a gang. The only one I can really think of is "Gals" and it only has a little bit of Miyu's life as a gang leader. There might be more, but none that I have seen. Also I really wanted to have a manga where the main charachter is not depressed about their life, perfect, and isn't completly naive. Of course they can't know everything, or that wouldn't be fun! XD...

Current website: My current URL is www.geocities.com/candyzpop

Well I hope you approve my application! I'd be so grateful! This new hosting will totally improve my website if accepted! ^_^
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Xepher

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« Reply #1 on: June 11, 2006, 10:52:31 am »
... Can't... even... respond... must... restrain... self.

Ticky, you want to take this one? :-P

Cassiopeia

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« Reply #2 on: June 11, 2006, 08:02:37 pm »
Is it that bad???? @_@ *Runs in circles, freaks out* Ah! crud! I screwed up the directions! I mean I want my URL to be candyzpop. Not Candyz Pop because we can't have capitals! @_@
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tickyhead

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« Reply #3 on: June 11, 2006, 08:37:54 pm »
Oh, if you insist Xepher. :P Just don't expect me to go easy on her.

Oooookay, first off, I'm glad you caught the URL thing. Not so glad that you didn't catch it in the first place, but at least I didn't have to say it for the billionth time.

Second, the email account you use doesn't matter, (as far as I know) as long as it's one you use regularly. No need for lavish excuses as to why your personal email is so private. Do you really think we're that evil here that we'd try to take advantage of it? :(

Now, art-wise and site-wise, I have no complaints. You've proved you can make a site that doesn't burn peoples' eyeballs, which is a step up from some people who apply, and your art is pretty good. There's two things that are going to be a problem, though. Most important is, where is all the other content? 4 comic pages and 3 things in the gallery, that's all you have up. I know geocities is not very forgiving of use of their bandwidth, but could you at least prove you have more than that? Maybe you have about 15 more pages hiding in your comp's hard drive? Maybe you've got a lot more art that's waiting to be put up, but geocities is preventing that? Give us a sign here!

Second, albeit a bit nitpicky, is still something to consider. Now, I'm not sure how you will take this, and by all means I'm not trying to be mean, or flame you, or anything.
Your "original" idea? Is not. In fact, it sounds like a ton of other plots I have heard, and probably a miilion more that I will hear in the future. Take out the "gang leader" idea for a second. (which, also? not original. In fact, making someone the leader of ANYTHING is generic. You'd get major mary-sue points right now on the litmus test) Now, what does it sound like?
"A girl with a tragic past thinks that her life could never get any better. But then she meets a new student at her school, and her life is changed forever (most likely for the better, after many tribulations and saving the world or some crap. Throw in some romance to spice it up, and presto!)"
Sound familiar? I thought so. (Also, if she's a gang leader, why bother with school?) SO, that leads to another question, "what makes your application so much better than anyone elses?" Fact is, lots of web-manga-ers apply here, and it's a pretty big part of the xeph site as it is. Possibly too big, almost. (hey, I do my fair share of the manga style, too! :P) So what is it that will make us like you soooooo much that you'll be allowed into the hosting community? I've seen a lot, I mean A LOT, of manga applications since I got here, many of them with generic plotlines or characters, that's not really the problem here. The problem is that you think that yours ISN'T generic, while most people who get in with a manga do it because they have a large archive, have spent a lot of time working on their comic, and KNOW that no matter what they do, it will still have a generic feel to it. You have a total of 4 pages, and two paragraphs of application citing how "original" it is. Humility is obviously not your strong point. ;)

Now, before you start citing the "original" character designs you made, let me be perfectly clear on what constitues an "original" idea. For one, tiger stripe hair? eeeyuck! Been there, done that. See it almost daily around my town. Strange looking characters an original idea does not make. You don't go out of your way to create an original character, you don't give them funny looking hair and clothes just because it's "different." You LET the character become original, both on the inside and outside. And tiger striped hair and the whole "I'm a bad girl gang leader! I'm on the bad side of life and I don't give a damn! Now watch me angst" thing is not going to cut it.

Also? Naming your site "candyz pop" is not helping your case. That and the rampant use of typos, which makes me think that you really aren't that dedicated to it, if you aren't willing to at least use a spell check or two before posting it.

Wow, that was longer than my usual critiques, sorry Xeph. Guess I should have at least gone a little easier on her. XD
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« Reply #4 on: June 11, 2006, 09:02:20 pm »
I thought Xepher was referring to the application structure, which I thought was mostly complete (compared to most of the recent ones).

I read the few pages of your manga and I really have to disagree that it's original for the same reasons Ticky said already.  I realize that it's popular to have that kind of character (minus the gang aspect) and those mangas sell well, so I'm not going to speculate on why you follow that plot.  However, I read most of the pages in your site, non-comic related too, and you used "East Azn," which is a major pet peeve of mine.  We're Asians, not Azn, and phonetically spelling our race is not going to make us cooler.
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Cassiopeia

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« Reply #5 on: June 11, 2006, 09:34:18 pm »
Ok I would just like to state there is no such thing as an original manga these days. Most all of them are based off of each other or similar. Like Hana Kimi and Girl Got Game, yet people still like both for their own twist. I actually don't think it's all original, I'm just throwing my own twist in it, that's what I'm trying to show. Note the word trying I used in the first comment? I really dislike it when people think I'm arrogant and that I think my manga is the best!  I actually think mine is really bad compared to the other links I have made with such as cafe aladdin.

With the hair, unless you think Cala from crystal cards, a site you have already hosted looks weird, then fine. But I like it, and as long as the author likes it and others can move on with their lives, then there should be no reason to flame.

Maybe it's because I have few pages updated that it's hard to see I have added my own twist here in there, and I'm trying to do this, but with real life and other things it's hard to update, and I just started. The reason why I wanted to be hosted so soon is because I didn't want to change all my links that I have made. But if you insist I will wait till I have more pages up before i ask to be hosted again.

Sorry about the east azn thing, I was just lazy, but I'll re post it for you griever ^_^...

With my webpage, well it was originally going to be for my junk site, but then someone said I should do a manga, so I did. If you hate the title so much I'll do my best to change it, it's just a pain and will take away from my art time. It may take me months to redo it all because I have limited time. And I don't want to stop doing the manga. I dislike it when ppl go on hiatus, so I don't want to do so.  

All in all, besides your comments about not having enough pages up , most of the comment are all opinion. Although I can see why you are all making comments about the originality. As i said I'm trying to create my own twist, the basic outline may be the same as many others, but it's the twist, jokes, charachter personalities, and so on that make the manga unique. I understand many of you have strong opinions I myself do as well. I'd appreciate it if you didn't judge me as arrogant or something because I do my best not to be. I really just wanted to try and appeal my site to you, that's all it is. And if I made it seem like I think my manga's all that, I'm sorry, I know it's generic in many ways, but I'm trying to add my own twist and share my art with other people so they can correct me and tell me how my story is. It's my first manga, and I'm doing my best to make it as good as I can.
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Xepher

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« Reply #6 on: June 11, 2006, 10:19:10 pm »
Tickyhead: Don't worry about being too harsh, you were being honest, not mean. And you got across most of what I was thinking.

Okay, I'll say my piece now. The thing is not just "oh, tiger-stripe hair isn't original" or anything as trivial as that. If you had a good comic, I wouldn't care if one of your characters had 6 eyes and an elbow for a nose. Your response here actually highlights most of the deeper reasons why this probably isn't going to work.

To quote "with real life and other things it's hard to update, and I just started." If you look at a lot of the older applications, you'll see that one of the main things I look for is whether or not someone can update regularly, of if their current site idea is just a phase they're in that's gonna get boring in a few weeks or months. You've put up, what, 3 pages? And you're already talking about how it's "hard to update." Think of this like a job interview. You just came in for your second interview, but you're late, because "It's just so hard to get up in the morning." I can't see the future, so I don't know whether you really will keep up with this comic, or if you'll get bored in three weeks and forget about it. What I CAN do is look for indicators and try to surmise what will happen. So far, those aren't looking so promising. "I was just lazy." You said. No, not very good at all.

As for the name... The username, yes, that has to match what I specified. The name of the comic itself, that's up to you, representing you and your art. But first off, I don't see how it relates to the comic. And secondly, pluralizing with a Z just screams "incompetent teenager!" Those are just my opinions however.

Now, ticky pointed out basically one main thing. You've got very little to actually show your creativity. (Keep in mind I'm looking for "original, creative content" as per the info page.) But in your response, you didn't actually do anything to remedy that complaint. You simply gave excuses, for why you hadn't updated more, or why we'd not seen the originality. Excuses don't help. If you're too busy with real life to update a comic regularly, that's fine, just don't expect me to host it.

Oh, one last thing. (Quoting again) "With the hair, unless you think Cala from crystal cards, a site you have already hosted looks weird, then fine."
Pointing out someone else and basically saying "but they did it too!" is definitely not going to help your cause. First, because it's a cop-out and second because if you read the info page, you'll note near the end... "And, yes, I know that many of the current sites here do not conform to these criteria. They were accepted before Xepher.net became so popular, and under the old Phase 1 guidelines."

Bottom line is this, we're not trying to "flame" you or whatever. You've got very little to show, and what you do have looks remarkably similar to a zillion other "manga" online. You have to do a good job fixing at least one of those before I'm going to seriously consider it.

tickyhead

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« Reply #7 on: June 11, 2006, 10:59:28 pm »
Quote from: Cassiopeia
Ok I would just like to state there is no such thing as an original manga these days. Most all of them are based off of each other or similar. Like Hana Kimi and Girl Got Game, yet people still like both for their own twist. I actually don't think it's all original, I'm just throwing my own twist in it, that's what I'm trying to show.
And I would just like to state that 1) citing OTHER comics as examples does not help much, as they are not YOUR comic itself and therefore not what we're talking about, and 2) No offence, but as I stated before, the ONE twist I have seen so far is not that....."twisty."

Quote from: Cassiopeia
With the hair, unless you think Cala from crystal cards, a site you have already hosted looks weird, then fine. But I like it, and as long as the author likes it and others can move on with their lives, then there should be no reason to flame.
Again, I'll go with Xeph on this one. Also, I stated quite plainly that I was NOT flaming you. At least not trying anyway...

Quote from: Cassiopeia
Maybe it's because I have few pages updated that it's hard to see I have added my own twist here in there, and I'm trying to do this, but with real life and other things it's hard to update, and I just started. The reason why I wanted to be hosted so soon is because I didn't want to change all my links that I have made. But if you insist I will wait till I have more pages up before i ask to be hosted again.
You should have waited in the first place, no offence. If real life is hard on you, don't apply for something that you have to show that you'll work hard for, when you can't. I've made this mistake plenty of times, and it never gets better. Also, you'll recall I said that most people who get in, get in (in part) because they have been doing this for, if not years, a long enough time to show that they are truely dedicated.

Quote from: Cassiopeia
All in all, besides your comments about not having enough pages up , most of the comment are all opinion.
Well, yeah. We're not robots here or something, we're human. And 99.9% of what humans say is, guess what? OPINION. You're stating your opinion, I'm stating mine, that's all it is.

Quote from: Cassiopeia
Although I can see why you are all making comments about the originality. As i said I'm trying to create my own twist, the basic outline may be the same as many others, but it's the twist, jokes, charachter personalities, and so on that make the manga unique. I understand many of you have strong opinions I myself do as well. I'd appreciate it if you didn't judge me as arrogant or something because I do my best not to be.
I don't judge, I evaluate. ;) And I evaluate applications based only on what I can see. For one, your manga is so undeveloped at the moment, that there are no plot twists. Therefore, I have no way of knowing whether your plot really "twists" or if it just "curves slightly," regardless of what you say. Also, you are making constant excuses for yourself. This is something I see all too often, people making excuses, trying to justify themselves to a total stranger. The thing is, I don't go on excuses. As I said, I go only on what I can see exists with my own two eyes. And when what I see doesn't match what you say, then I have to evaluate the person who's applying.

Quote from: Cassiopeia
I really just wanted to try and appeal my site to you, that's all it is. And if I made it seem like I think my manga's all that, I'm sorry, I know it's generic in many ways, but I'm trying to add my own twist and share my art with other people so they can correct me and tell me how my story is. It's my first manga, and I'm doing my best to make it as good as I can.
Here's a tip for "appealing" to an artist-based community: BE HONEST. If you think it isn't that great, don't try and sell it like you're on a commercial, just say what you really think about your application, your art, your comic, anything. We're not business execs or something, (well, I'm not, I dunno about the other people here :D) I'm not "all about the pitch," it's the actual content that I go on. Well, okay, content, and how you respond to me picking your content apart peice by piece. ;)

As for it being your first comic atempt, bravo. I started out much worse, trust me. That does not, however, make me any more sympathetic to you or your comic. Sorry.
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Cassiopeia

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« Reply #8 on: June 12, 2006, 12:16:22 am »
Alright, but the bottom line is, you are flaming whether you mean to or not. And personally I don't liked to be flamed, I don't think anybody does. Yes I do have a hard time, but as I said I dislike hiatus, so I will continue this manga either way. I do seriously wish if you did not like it, then just say so instead of bon barding me with all these statements of how it's not original. Because in truth it really hurts ones feelings and confidence. It's like putting someone down because it's hard to think of an original idea. With the whole I'm lazy, If I was would I have spent the whole time trying to make sure I got all the ratings and stuff and going through the trouble of trying to get hosted? If you don't want to host, then please just state so, I wouldn't mind. I mean explanations are great, but seriously I feel it was a little too far. If you don't like my manga it's fine there are always people who don't, but I know there are so people out there who like it, so I'll continue it and find a new host if worst comes to worst. If the problem is you think I'm being rude, I'm not in my mind, it's hard to express one's feelings over the net. I do feel a little hurt that you guys really dislike my site, but I don't hate you for it. So thanks anyways.
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tickyhead

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« Reply #9 on: June 12, 2006, 12:24:04 am »
Hey Xeph, I think we broke her. :( The rest of you can take it from here, I don't think I'm helping any...
I don't hate everyone, I'm just very, very disappointed in them.

Cassiopeia

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« Reply #10 on: June 12, 2006, 01:30:26 am »
Nah, It's hard to break me ^_^... I'll be good, I'll apply agian when the summers over after I have posted at least 20 something pages or so to prove to you I'm not lieing! I understand you are nice people and I respect that ^_^ I don't hold grudges XD. I can kind of see where you guys are coming from and I didn't mean to sound like a brat or anything, I just think geocities stinks and people said I should switch. But if I have to wait till I have posted more, then I'm good with it. I guess the reason I felt hurt the most was because it seemes you commented on the bad points of my manga way more then others that I saw on the forum. It made me feel a little like I was getting unfair treatment since the post were way longer about the bad points of my site. But it sems I have a chance of getting hosted someday in the waaaaaaay future if I'm good and work hard, I'm good, I''ll just work more and then apply, which was my original plan until I saw your hosting and that my friend was telling me how geocities sucks so bad and trying to get me to move. As i said thank you. And I'll be trying to post more on the forums, maybe get some new ideas for my manga ^_-...
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Munerift

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« Reply #11 on: June 12, 2006, 02:44:35 am »
There is a problem here Cassiopeia, and it's a breakdown of communication to you.

Xepher and Ticky have been trying to evaluate your application, and add some personality to it. No one likes a cold yes or no. You've taken the defensive on this then, and continue to think that anyone who isnt saying "gee your work is g8!" are flaming you. They are not, but it is mildly amusing to watch the little ques you've put out throughout this on clues to who you are. You have an idea, and it's your idea; and no one can stomp on them unless you let them.

Xeph took the time to write out an entire process for applicants to follow, and expected that if you wanted a site there than you would take the time to follow the guides set in place. In doing so I can assure you that it would take you 1/10th of the time than it did for Xeph to come up with the application principles.

By your own example, you've demonstrated to this community (and I stress community, this isnt simply hosting; it's a working, breathing, community.) that you would not be a well part of it. Everyone's opinions carry some weight in the decision of your acceptance or denial because we are a community. I would suggest that you look to a gallery site, or a comic hosting site and spend some time getting to know your story, and creating a base of work for you then to reapply at a later date. As has been pointed out, many attempts to create comics and have failed; we need to see yours succeed alittle before it's considered.
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Xepher

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« Reply #12 on: June 12, 2006, 03:09:09 am »
Of course we're pointing out what's wrong with your comic. And yes, that is just our opinions. That's how criticism works. If it hurts your feelings to have people tell you what they really think, then posting your art in public places is probably a bad idea. For better or worse, I'd suggest you try to run that comic and develop a story for a while, then come back if you're still interested. http://www.comicgenesis.com/ is a bit better than geocities. You'll still get ads, but as far as I understand, everyone who applies gets in. It'll let you have a decent place to host the comic while you build up an archive and refine your story. If you're still interested, come back in 6 months with some stuff to show.

Cassiopeia

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« Reply #13 on: June 12, 2006, 03:32:59 am »
I understand many people have took time to write things out for me, but I'm not upset they dislike my work, I just felt that I was being used as an example of what not to do. But after I read out a couple of times I understand. Like I said I'm highly opinioniative.

Actually I'm on some of forums already, I just meant that I'd come post here some more and maybe get to know people better. Sometimes I have a hard time not judging people by an action they have performed, but I know it's deeper then that and people have many different sides. I don't need praise what so ever. I'm not doing my manga for praise, I'm doing it because I love to draw and come up with stories and things (Even though they are based on other stories sometimes). Of course Praise is always nice here and there.

Also, I think you misunderstand me, it's not the time I put into writing these post at all, I knew from the begginning that it might go to waste. It's that I was shocked and a little hurt that there was so much about how my manga isn't going to work, and I think if many other people were in my shoes they'd be a little hurt to. I'm just the kind of person who's stubborn and I don't like to be thought of as arrongant. So I stand up for myself. I probably misunderstood what Ticky was trying to say though. When I first read it, it sounded like Ticky thought I was a an arroant teenager who thinks I'm queen of the world, and I didn't want people to think of me that way. But of course I probably went to far in my third post as well, it isn't Tickys or xepher's fault at all, as I stated I don't hate, I just get hurt sometimes.  

And your right about the strait out yes or no, that wouldn't be good either. I just thought there be less about it like, "You don't have enough content and try to make it more original." Instead of all the bits and details. Even though I have been working on it for a short amount of time, each page took me about a week to do, and since my html skills were bad it took me months to get them right and make the site look nice. So I'm pretty sure everyone knows how it feels to have taken some time and effort into something and have it go to waste, I sorta felt like that. Though luckily I didn't lose my old site @_@, that'd be bad.  

I'd appreciate if I could get to know the community, just posting and trying to make new friends and such. If no one wants to become good aquantences with me, I can accept that.
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griever

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« Reply #14 on: June 12, 2006, 03:38:28 am »
Quote from: Cassiopeia
I guess the reason I felt hurt the most was because it seemes you commented on the bad points of my manga way more then others that I saw on the forum.
On the other hand, you're one of the few with a more complete application.  Whether people liked it or not is different, but you gave them material to either support or criticize.  It's not as negative as those who post speculative projects without a website (or any examples) to show for it.  Ticky's just the best, or at least, takes the most time, to write out an analysis.

If you don't want to move your site from Geocities, may I suggest keeping the background, character profiles, artist statement, etc. there, while keeping your comic on Deviant Art (deviantart.com)?  That way, you have both proof of HTML/website design and a place to build up a gallery without getting the bandwidth exceeded message all the time.  You may also find a community there to help you with your manga/art.

EDIT: Here's another suggestion from a non-artist, so I am in no way experienced enough to be a legitimate source.  If you want to take Ticky and Xepher's suggestions regarding plot and character design, one thing to do may be to create a bunch of "short" strips, like the 4 panel ones you see in the newspapers.  Get to know your characters, figure out their world more?  In addition to giving you time to work on plot and characters, it will also build up your portfolio and may give you material to incorporate later on.  Kind of like the stuff if you flip to the back of manga books, really. ^_^
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